Fwd: Get started with XWiki

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Fwd: Get started with XWiki

vmassol
Administrator
Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.

Ideas?

Thanks
-Vincent

> Begin forwarded message:
>
> From: Vincent Massol
> Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
> Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
> To: XXX
> Cc: XXX
>
> Hi Christian,
>
>> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
>>
>> It's not working.
>>
>> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart' users, not experts.
>
> If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s easy and you have nothing to do.
>
> Which distribution did you choose and use?
>
>> And there is no help from the website.
>>
>> Oracle Linux 7.
>> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP Fri May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
>> Java 10
>> Xwiki 10.3
>> tomcat.
>>
>> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
>
> It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully working with Java 9.
>
> Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be dropped in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a place where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener that would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would say at the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that wouldn’t be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback from users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java 9 and 10.
>
>> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
>
> You need to read the installation page ;)
>
> See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
> http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
>
>> Here is the error:
>>
>>
>> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
>> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
>> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
>
> [snip]
>
>> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field found for reverse order comparator!
>> at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.java:276)
>> ... 249 mor
>
> [snip
>
>> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field found for reverse order comparator!
>> at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.java:276)
>> ... 249 mor
>
> What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not compatible with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably just need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses JBoss Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
>
> What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of using XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an issue for it and work to make it work.
>
> Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not the right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we have a user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
>
> I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by trying with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently work with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the positive side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you will transform your negative experience into a positive one, by contributing to the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
>
> Thanks
> -Vincent Massol

[snip]

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Re: Fwd: Get started with XWiki

Eduard Moraru
Hi,

On the palliative side (i.e. not actually fixing, but at least making life
a bit easier), we might consider a naming scheme for the downloadable that
includes that supported java version, e.g. xwiki-10.3-java8.zip (though
this might also lead users to thinking that the java 8 runtime is
included... which might not be that bad of an idea, if we think about it...
at least for the zip version that is for demo purposes, which already
contains the web server, the database, but still expects the user to
understand and install the correct Java runtime, which makes no sense.)

So, yeah... TL;DR: add the java8 runtime to the .zip package and make life
easier for everyone. Optionally (though not sure if needed anymore, if we
bundle it), include it in the .zip file name.

Of course, the production install, if done manually (i.e. not through
.deb/.rpm packages), expects that the user reads the documentation.

Thanks,
Eduard

On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:19 AM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.
>
> Ideas?
>
> Thanks
> -Vincent
>
> > Begin forwarded message:
> >
> > From: Vincent Massol
> > Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
> > Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
> > To: XXX
> > Cc: XXX
> >
> > Hi Christian,
> >
> >> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
> >>
> >> It's not working.
> >>
> >> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an
> expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart' users, not
> experts.
> >
> > If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s easy
> and you have nothing to do.
> >
> > Which distribution did you choose and use?
> >
> >> And there is no help from the website.
> >>
> >> Oracle Linux 7.
> >> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP Fri
> May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
> >> Java 10
> >> Xwiki 10.3
> >> tomcat.
> >>
> >> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
> >
> > It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully working
> with Java 9.
> >
> > Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the
> distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be dropped
> in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a place
> where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener that
> would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would say at
> the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that wouldn’t
> be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback from
> users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java 9 and
> 10.
> >
> >> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
> >
> > You need to read the installation page ;)
> >
> > See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
> AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
> > http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
> AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
> >
> >> Here is the error:
> >>
> >>
> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
> colorThemeInit.vm
> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
> colorThemeInit.vm
> >> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while
> evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
> >
> > [snip]
> >
> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field found
> for reverse order comparator!
> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
> java:276)
> >>      ... 249 mor
> >
> > [snip
> >
> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field found
> for reverse order comparator!
> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
> java:276)
> >>      ... 249 mor
> >
> > What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not compatible
> with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss
> Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably just
> need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses JBoss
> Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
> >
> > What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of using
> XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an issue
> for it and work to make it work.
> >
> > Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not the
> right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we have a
> user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
> >
> > I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by trying
> with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently work
> with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the positive
> side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you will
> transform your negative experience into a positive one, by contributing to
> the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
> >
> > Thanks
> > -Vincent Massol
>
> [snip]
>
>
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Re: Fwd: Get started with XWiki

Thomas Mortagne
Administrator
One issue with embedded Java (OpenJDK I guess) is that it would make
the zip quite huge.

On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:30 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> On the palliative side (i.e. not actually fixing, but at least making life
> a bit easier), we might consider a naming scheme for the downloadable that
> includes that supported java version, e.g. xwiki-10.3-java8.zip (though
> this might also lead users to thinking that the java 8 runtime is
> included... which might not be that bad of an idea, if we think about it...
> at least for the zip version that is for demo purposes, which already
> contains the web server, the database, but still expects the user to
> understand and install the correct Java runtime, which makes no sense.)
>
> So, yeah... TL;DR: add the java8 runtime to the .zip package and make life
> easier for everyone. Optionally (though not sure if needed anymore, if we
> bundle it), include it in the .zip file name.
>
> Of course, the production install, if done manually (i.e. not through
> .deb/.rpm packages), expects that the user reads the documentation.
>
> Thanks,
> Eduard
>
> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:19 AM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.
>>
>> Ideas?
>>
>> Thanks
>> -Vincent
>>
>> > Begin forwarded message:
>> >
>> > From: Vincent Massol
>> > Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
>> > Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
>> > To: XXX
>> > Cc: XXX
>> >
>> > Hi Christian,
>> >
>> >> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
>> >>
>> >> It's not working.
>> >>
>> >> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an
>> expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart' users, not
>> experts.
>> >
>> > If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s easy
>> and you have nothing to do.
>> >
>> > Which distribution did you choose and use?
>> >
>> >> And there is no help from the website.
>> >>
>> >> Oracle Linux 7.
>> >> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP Fri
>> May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
>> >> Java 10
>> >> Xwiki 10.3
>> >> tomcat.
>> >>
>> >> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
>> >
>> > It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully working
>> with Java 9.
>> >
>> > Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the
>> distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be dropped
>> in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a place
>> where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener that
>> would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would say at
>> the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that wouldn’t
>> be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback from
>> users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java 9 and
>> 10.
>> >
>> >> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
>> >
>> > You need to read the installation page ;)
>> >
>> > See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>> AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
>> > http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>> AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
>> >
>> >> Here is the error:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>> colorThemeInit.vm
>> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>> colorThemeInit.vm
>> >> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while
>> evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
>> >
>> > [snip]
>> >
>> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field found
>> for reverse order comparator!
>> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>> java:276)
>> >>      ... 249 mor
>> >
>> > [snip
>> >
>> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field found
>> for reverse order comparator!
>> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>> java:276)
>> >>      ... 249 mor
>> >
>> > What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not compatible
>> with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss
>> Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably just
>> need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses JBoss
>> Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
>> >
>> > What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of using
>> XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an issue
>> for it and work to make it work.
>> >
>> > Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not the
>> right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we have a
>> user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
>> >
>> > I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by trying
>> with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently work
>> with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the positive
>> side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you will
>> transform your negative experience into a positive one, by contributing to
>> the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
>> >
>> > Thanks
>> > -Vincent Massol
>>
>> [snip]
>>
>>



--
Thomas Mortagne
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Re: Fwd: Get started with XWiki

Eduard Moraru
AFAIR, Eclipse also does this (i.e. bundle their own JRE), we could look
into how they do it.

On a quick check, OpenJDK's JRE is only 38.4 MB (
http://jdk.java.net/java-se-ri/8) ... I find that acceptable.

FTR, the JDK is 164 MB.

Thanks,
Eduard

On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:40 AM, Thomas Mortagne <[hidden email]
> wrote:

> One issue with embedded Java (OpenJDK I guess) is that it would make
> the zip quite huge.
>
> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:30 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > On the palliative side (i.e. not actually fixing, but at least making
> life
> > a bit easier), we might consider a naming scheme for the downloadable
> that
> > includes that supported java version, e.g. xwiki-10.3-java8.zip (though
> > this might also lead users to thinking that the java 8 runtime is
> > included... which might not be that bad of an idea, if we think about
> it...
> > at least for the zip version that is for demo purposes, which already
> > contains the web server, the database, but still expects the user to
> > understand and install the correct Java runtime, which makes no sense.)
> >
> > So, yeah... TL;DR: add the java8 runtime to the .zip package and make
> life
> > easier for everyone. Optionally (though not sure if needed anymore, if we
> > bundle it), include it in the .zip file name.
> >
> > Of course, the production install, if done manually (i.e. not through
> > .deb/.rpm packages), expects that the user reads the documentation.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Eduard
> >
> > On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:19 AM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> >
> >> Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.
> >>
> >> Ideas?
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >> -Vincent
> >>
> >> > Begin forwarded message:
> >> >
> >> > From: Vincent Massol
> >> > Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
> >> > Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
> >> > To: XXX
> >> > Cc: XXX
> >> >
> >> > Hi Christian,
> >> >
> >> >> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> It's not working.
> >> >>
> >> >> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an
> >> expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart' users,
> not
> >> experts.
> >> >
> >> > If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s easy
> >> and you have nothing to do.
> >> >
> >> > Which distribution did you choose and use?
> >> >
> >> >> And there is no help from the website.
> >> >>
> >> >> Oracle Linux 7.
> >> >> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP Fri
> >> May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
> >> >> Java 10
> >> >> Xwiki 10.3
> >> >> tomcat.
> >> >>
> >> >> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
> >> >
> >> > It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully
> working
> >> with Java 9.
> >> >
> >> > Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the
> >> distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be
> dropped
> >> in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a
> place
> >> where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener
> that
> >> would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would say
> at
> >> the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that
> wouldn’t
> >> be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback from
> >> users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java 9
> and
> >> 10.
> >> >
> >> >> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
> >> >
> >> > You need to read the installation page ;)
> >> >
> >> > See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
> >> AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
> >> > http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
> >> AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
> >> >
> >> >> Here is the error:
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
> >> colorThemeInit.vm
> >> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
> >> colorThemeInit.vm
> >> >> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while
> >> evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
> >> >
> >> > [snip]
> >> >
> >> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field found
> >> for reverse order comparator!
> >> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
> >> java:276)
> >> >>      ... 249 mor
> >> >
> >> > [snip
> >> >
> >> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field found
> >> for reverse order comparator!
> >> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
> >> java:276)
> >> >>      ... 249 mor
> >> >
> >> > What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not
> compatible
> >> with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss
> >> Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably
> just
> >> need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses
> JBoss
> >> Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
> >> >
> >> > What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of using
> >> XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an
> issue
> >> for it and work to make it work.
> >> >
> >> > Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not
> the
> >> right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we have a
> >> user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
> >> >
> >> > I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by
> trying
> >> with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently work
> >> with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the
> positive
> >> side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you will
> >> transform your negative experience into a positive one, by contributing
> to
> >> the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
> >> >
> >> > Thanks
> >> > -Vincent Massol
> >>
> >> [snip]
> >>
> >>
>
>
>
> --
> Thomas Mortagne
>
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Re: Fwd: Get started with XWiki

Eduard Moraru
Correction, the above are Oracle builds, not OpenJDK :)

On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:49 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> AFAIR, Eclipse also does this (i.e. bundle their own JRE), we could look
> into how they do it.
>
> On a quick check, OpenJDK's JRE is only 38.4 MB (
> http://jdk.java.net/java-se-ri/8) ... I find that acceptable.
>
> FTR, the JDK is 164 MB.
>
> Thanks,
> Eduard
>
> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:40 AM, Thomas Mortagne <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> One issue with embedded Java (OpenJDK I guess) is that it would make
>> the zip quite huge.
>>
>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:30 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > On the palliative side (i.e. not actually fixing, but at least making
>> life
>> > a bit easier), we might consider a naming scheme for the downloadable
>> that
>> > includes that supported java version, e.g. xwiki-10.3-java8.zip (though
>> > this might also lead users to thinking that the java 8 runtime is
>> > included... which might not be that bad of an idea, if we think about
>> it...
>> > at least for the zip version that is for demo purposes, which already
>> > contains the web server, the database, but still expects the user to
>> > understand and install the correct Java runtime, which makes no sense.)
>> >
>> > So, yeah... TL;DR: add the java8 runtime to the .zip package and make
>> life
>> > easier for everyone. Optionally (though not sure if needed anymore, if
>> we
>> > bundle it), include it in the .zip file name.
>> >
>> > Of course, the production install, if done manually (i.e. not through
>> > .deb/.rpm packages), expects that the user reads the documentation.
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> > Eduard
>> >
>> > On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:19 AM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.
>> >>
>> >> Ideas?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks
>> >> -Vincent
>> >>
>> >> > Begin forwarded message:
>> >> >
>> >> > From: Vincent Massol
>> >> > Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
>> >> > Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
>> >> > To: XXX
>> >> > Cc: XXX
>> >> >
>> >> > Hi Christian,
>> >> >
>> >> >> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> It's not working.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an
>> >> expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart' users,
>> not
>> >> experts.
>> >> >
>> >> > If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s easy
>> >> and you have nothing to do.
>> >> >
>> >> > Which distribution did you choose and use?
>> >> >
>> >> >> And there is no help from the website.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Oracle Linux 7.
>> >> >> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP Fri
>> >> May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
>> >> >> Java 10
>> >> >> Xwiki 10.3
>> >> >> tomcat.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
>> >> >
>> >> > It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully
>> working
>> >> with Java 9.
>> >> >
>> >> > Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the
>> >> distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be
>> dropped
>> >> in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a
>> place
>> >> where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener
>> that
>> >> would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would say
>> at
>> >> the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that
>> wouldn’t
>> >> be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback
>> from
>> >> users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java 9
>> and
>> >> 10.
>> >> >
>> >> >> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
>> >> >
>> >> > You need to read the installation page ;)
>> >> >
>> >> > See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>> >> AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
>> >> > http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>> >> AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
>> >> >
>> >> >> Here is the error:
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>> >> colorThemeInit.vm
>> >> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>> >> colorThemeInit.vm
>> >> >> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while
>> >> evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
>> >> >
>> >> > [snip]
>> >> >
>> >> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field found
>> >> for reverse order comparator!
>> >> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>> >> java:276)
>> >> >>      ... 249 mor
>> >> >
>> >> > [snip
>> >> >
>> >> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field found
>> >> for reverse order comparator!
>> >> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>> >> java:276)
>> >> >>      ... 249 mor
>> >> >
>> >> > What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not
>> compatible
>> >> with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss
>> >> Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably
>> just
>> >> need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses
>> JBoss
>> >> Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
>> >> >
>> >> > What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of using
>> >> XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an
>> issue
>> >> for it and work to make it work.
>> >> >
>> >> > Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not
>> the
>> >> right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we have
>> a
>> >> user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
>> >> >
>> >> > I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by
>> trying
>> >> with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently work
>> >> with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the
>> positive
>> >> side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you will
>> >> transform your negative experience into a positive one, by
>> contributing to
>> >> the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
>> >> >
>> >> > Thanks
>> >> > -Vincent Massol
>> >>
>> >> [snip]
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Thomas Mortagne
>>
>
>
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Re: Fwd: Get started with XWiki

Eduard Moraru
Correction to the correction: They are OpenJDK, got confused by the Oracle
logo. :)

On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:51 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Correction, the above are Oracle builds, not OpenJDK :)
>
> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:49 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
>> AFAIR, Eclipse also does this (i.e. bundle their own JRE), we could look
>> into how they do it.
>>
>> On a quick check, OpenJDK's JRE is only 38.4 MB (
>> http://jdk.java.net/java-se-ri/8) ... I find that acceptable.
>>
>> FTR, the JDK is 164 MB.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Eduard
>>
>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:40 AM, Thomas Mortagne <
>> [hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> One issue with embedded Java (OpenJDK I guess) is that it would make
>>> the zip quite huge.
>>>
>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:30 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
>>> wrote:
>>> > Hi,
>>> >
>>> > On the palliative side (i.e. not actually fixing, but at least making
>>> life
>>> > a bit easier), we might consider a naming scheme for the downloadable
>>> that
>>> > includes that supported java version, e.g. xwiki-10.3-java8.zip (though
>>> > this might also lead users to thinking that the java 8 runtime is
>>> > included... which might not be that bad of an idea, if we think about
>>> it...
>>> > at least for the zip version that is for demo purposes, which already
>>> > contains the web server, the database, but still expects the user to
>>> > understand and install the correct Java runtime, which makes no sense.)
>>> >
>>> > So, yeah... TL;DR: add the java8 runtime to the .zip package and make
>>> life
>>> > easier for everyone. Optionally (though not sure if needed anymore, if
>>> we
>>> > bundle it), include it in the .zip file name.
>>> >
>>> > Of course, the production install, if done manually (i.e. not through
>>> > .deb/.rpm packages), expects that the user reads the documentation.
>>> >
>>> > Thanks,
>>> > Eduard
>>> >
>>> > On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:19 AM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]>
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.
>>> >>
>>> >> Ideas?
>>> >>
>>> >> Thanks
>>> >> -Vincent
>>> >>
>>> >> > Begin forwarded message:
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: Vincent Massol
>>> >> > Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
>>> >> > Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
>>> >> > To: XXX
>>> >> > Cc: XXX
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Hi Christian,
>>> >> >
>>> >> >> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> It's not working.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an
>>> >> expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart' users,
>>> not
>>> >> experts.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s
>>> easy
>>> >> and you have nothing to do.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Which distribution did you choose and use?
>>> >> >
>>> >> >> And there is no help from the website.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> Oracle Linux 7.
>>> >> >> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP
>>> Fri
>>> >> May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
>>> >> >> Java 10
>>> >> >> Xwiki 10.3
>>> >> >> tomcat.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully
>>> working
>>> >> with Java 9.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the
>>> >> distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be
>>> dropped
>>> >> in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a
>>> place
>>> >> where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener
>>> that
>>> >> would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would
>>> say at
>>> >> the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that
>>> wouldn’t
>>> >> be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback
>>> from
>>> >> users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java
>>> 9 and
>>> >> 10.
>>> >> >
>>> >> >> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > You need to read the installation page ;)
>>> >> >
>>> >> > See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>>> >> AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
>>> >> > http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>>> >> AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
>>> >> >
>>> >> >> Here is the error:
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>>> >> colorThemeInit.vm
>>> >> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>>> >> colorThemeInit.vm
>>> >> >> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while
>>> >> evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
>>> >> >
>>> >> > [snip]
>>> >> >
>>> >> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
>>> found
>>> >> for reverse order comparator!
>>> >> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>>> >> java:276)
>>> >> >>      ... 249 mor
>>> >> >
>>> >> > [snip
>>> >> >
>>> >> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
>>> found
>>> >> for reverse order comparator!
>>> >> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>>> >> java:276)
>>> >> >>      ... 249 mor
>>> >> >
>>> >> > What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not
>>> compatible
>>> >> with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss
>>> >> Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably
>>> just
>>> >> need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses
>>> JBoss
>>> >> Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of
>>> using
>>> >> XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an
>>> issue
>>> >> for it and work to make it work.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not
>>> the
>>> >> right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we
>>> have a
>>> >> user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by
>>> trying
>>> >> with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently
>>> work
>>> >> with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the
>>> positive
>>> >> side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you will
>>> >> transform your negative experience into a positive one, by
>>> contributing to
>>> >> the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Thanks
>>> >> > -Vincent Massol
>>> >>
>>> >> [snip]
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Thomas Mortagne
>>>
>>
>>
>
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Re: Fwd: Get started with XWiki

Thomas Mortagne
Administrator
In reply to this post by Eduard Moraru
On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:49 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]> wrote:
> AFAIR, Eclipse also does this (i.e. bundle their own JRE), we could look
> into how they do it.

Eclipse JDT comes with its own Java compiler but you are supposed to
install Java to run Eclipse itself.

>
> On a quick check, OpenJDK's JRE is only 38.4 MB (
> http://jdk.java.net/java-se-ri/8) ... I find that acceptable.

Not sure the license allow us to embbed what's on that page.

38.4MB is probably only for one system, I think you need 3 of those
(Linux, Windows, Mac)

>
> FTR, the JDK is 164 MB.
>
> Thanks,
> Eduard
>
> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:40 AM, Thomas Mortagne <[hidden email]
>> wrote:
>
>> One issue with embedded Java (OpenJDK I guess) is that it would make
>> the zip quite huge.
>>
>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:30 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > On the palliative side (i.e. not actually fixing, but at least making
>> life
>> > a bit easier), we might consider a naming scheme for the downloadable
>> that
>> > includes that supported java version, e.g. xwiki-10.3-java8.zip (though
>> > this might also lead users to thinking that the java 8 runtime is
>> > included... which might not be that bad of an idea, if we think about
>> it...
>> > at least for the zip version that is for demo purposes, which already
>> > contains the web server, the database, but still expects the user to
>> > understand and install the correct Java runtime, which makes no sense.)
>> >
>> > So, yeah... TL;DR: add the java8 runtime to the .zip package and make
>> life
>> > easier for everyone. Optionally (though not sure if needed anymore, if we
>> > bundle it), include it in the .zip file name.
>> >
>> > Of course, the production install, if done manually (i.e. not through
>> > .deb/.rpm packages), expects that the user reads the documentation.
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> > Eduard
>> >
>> > On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:19 AM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.
>> >>
>> >> Ideas?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks
>> >> -Vincent
>> >>
>> >> > Begin forwarded message:
>> >> >
>> >> > From: Vincent Massol
>> >> > Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
>> >> > Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
>> >> > To: XXX
>> >> > Cc: XXX
>> >> >
>> >> > Hi Christian,
>> >> >
>> >> >> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> It's not working.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an
>> >> expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart' users,
>> not
>> >> experts.
>> >> >
>> >> > If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s easy
>> >> and you have nothing to do.
>> >> >
>> >> > Which distribution did you choose and use?
>> >> >
>> >> >> And there is no help from the website.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Oracle Linux 7.
>> >> >> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP Fri
>> >> May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
>> >> >> Java 10
>> >> >> Xwiki 10.3
>> >> >> tomcat.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
>> >> >
>> >> > It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully
>> working
>> >> with Java 9.
>> >> >
>> >> > Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the
>> >> distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be
>> dropped
>> >> in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a
>> place
>> >> where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener
>> that
>> >> would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would say
>> at
>> >> the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that
>> wouldn’t
>> >> be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback from
>> >> users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java 9
>> and
>> >> 10.
>> >> >
>> >> >> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
>> >> >
>> >> > You need to read the installation page ;)
>> >> >
>> >> > See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>> >> AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
>> >> > http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>> >> AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
>> >> >
>> >> >> Here is the error:
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>> >> colorThemeInit.vm
>> >> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>> >> colorThemeInit.vm
>> >> >> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while
>> >> evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
>> >> >
>> >> > [snip]
>> >> >
>> >> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field found
>> >> for reverse order comparator!
>> >> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>> >> java:276)
>> >> >>      ... 249 mor
>> >> >
>> >> > [snip
>> >> >
>> >> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field found
>> >> for reverse order comparator!
>> >> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>> >> java:276)
>> >> >>      ... 249 mor
>> >> >
>> >> > What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not
>> compatible
>> >> with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss
>> >> Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably
>> just
>> >> need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses
>> JBoss
>> >> Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
>> >> >
>> >> > What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of using
>> >> XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an
>> issue
>> >> for it and work to make it work.
>> >> >
>> >> > Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not
>> the
>> >> right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we have a
>> >> user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
>> >> >
>> >> > I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by
>> trying
>> >> with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently work
>> >> with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the
>> positive
>> >> side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you will
>> >> transform your negative experience into a positive one, by contributing
>> to
>> >> the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
>> >> >
>> >> > Thanks
>> >> > -Vincent Massol
>> >>
>> >> [snip]
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Thomas Mortagne
>>



--
Thomas Mortagne
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Re: Fwd: Get started with XWiki

Eduard Moraru
There seem to be some resources on the topic:

https://github.com/libgdx/libgdx/wiki/Bundling-a-JRE
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/7071133/how-to-bundle-a-jre-with-launch4j
https://codeiseasy.wordpress.com/2012/07/31/including-a-jre-in-a-tycho-build/

...so it's not such an uncommon practice.

On the legal side, OpenJDK should be the obvious choice:
https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/4824/is-it-legal-to-bundle-oracles-jre-with-an-open-source-program/4826

IMO, it would make sense to provide the full and ready to test package,
rather than an only 90% ready to test one.

Thanks,
Eduard

On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Thomas Mortagne <[hidden email]
> wrote:

> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:49 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> > AFAIR, Eclipse also does this (i.e. bundle their own JRE), we could look
> > into how they do it.
>
> Eclipse JDT comes with its own Java compiler but you are supposed to
> install Java to run Eclipse itself.
>
> >
> > On a quick check, OpenJDK's JRE is only 38.4 MB (
> > http://jdk.java.net/java-se-ri/8) ... I find that acceptable.
>
> Not sure the license allow us to embbed what's on that page.
>
> 38.4MB is probably only for one system, I think you need 3 of those
> (Linux, Windows, Mac)
>
> >
> > FTR, the JDK is 164 MB.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Eduard
> >
> > On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:40 AM, Thomas Mortagne <
> [hidden email]
> >> wrote:
> >
> >> One issue with embedded Java (OpenJDK I guess) is that it would make
> >> the zip quite huge.
> >>
> >> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:30 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
> >> wrote:
> >> > Hi,
> >> >
> >> > On the palliative side (i.e. not actually fixing, but at least making
> >> life
> >> > a bit easier), we might consider a naming scheme for the downloadable
> >> that
> >> > includes that supported java version, e.g. xwiki-10.3-java8.zip
> (though
> >> > this might also lead users to thinking that the java 8 runtime is
> >> > included... which might not be that bad of an idea, if we think about
> >> it...
> >> > at least for the zip version that is for demo purposes, which already
> >> > contains the web server, the database, but still expects the user to
> >> > understand and install the correct Java runtime, which makes no
> sense.)
> >> >
> >> > So, yeah... TL;DR: add the java8 runtime to the .zip package and make
> >> life
> >> > easier for everyone. Optionally (though not sure if needed anymore,
> if we
> >> > bundle it), include it in the .zip file name.
> >> >
> >> > Of course, the production install, if done manually (i.e. not through
> >> > .deb/.rpm packages), expects that the user reads the documentation.
> >> >
> >> > Thanks,
> >> > Eduard
> >> >
> >> > On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:19 AM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]>
> >> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.
> >> >>
> >> >> Ideas?
> >> >>
> >> >> Thanks
> >> >> -Vincent
> >> >>
> >> >> > Begin forwarded message:
> >> >> >
> >> >> > From: Vincent Massol
> >> >> > Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
> >> >> > Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
> >> >> > To: XXX
> >> >> > Cc: XXX
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Hi Christian,
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> It's not working.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an
> >> >> expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart' users,
> >> not
> >> >> experts.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s
> easy
> >> >> and you have nothing to do.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Which distribution did you choose and use?
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> And there is no help from the website.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Oracle Linux 7.
> >> >> >> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP
> Fri
> >> >> May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
> >> >> >> Java 10
> >> >> >> Xwiki 10.3
> >> >> >> tomcat.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully
> >> working
> >> >> with Java 9.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the
> >> >> distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be
> >> dropped
> >> >> in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a
> >> place
> >> >> where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener
> >> that
> >> >> would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would
> say
> >> at
> >> >> the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that
> >> wouldn’t
> >> >> be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback
> from
> >> >> users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java
> 9
> >> and
> >> >> 10.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
> >> >> >
> >> >> > You need to read the installation page ;)
> >> >> >
> >> >> > See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
> >> >> AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
> >> >> > http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
> >> >> AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> Here is the error:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
> >> >> colorThemeInit.vm
> >> >> >> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
> >> >> colorThemeInit.vm
> >> >> >> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while
> >> >> evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
> >> >> >
> >> >> > [snip]
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
> found
> >> >> for reverse order comparator!
> >> >> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
> >> >> java:276)
> >> >> >>      ... 249 mor
> >> >> >
> >> >> > [snip
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
> found
> >> >> for reverse order comparator!
> >> >> >>      at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
> >> >> java:276)
> >> >> >>      ... 249 mor
> >> >> >
> >> >> > What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not
> >> compatible
> >> >> with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss
> >> >> Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably
> >> just
> >> >> need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses
> >> JBoss
> >> >> Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of
> using
> >> >> XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an
> >> issue
> >> >> for it and work to make it work.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not
> >> the
> >> >> right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we
> have a
> >> >> user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by
> >> trying
> >> >> with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently
> work
> >> >> with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the
> >> positive
> >> >> side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you
> will
> >> >> transform your negative experience into a positive one, by
> contributing
> >> to
> >> >> the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Thanks
> >> >> > -Vincent Massol
> >> >>
> >> >> [snip]
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Thomas Mortagne
> >>
>
>
>
> --
> Thomas Mortagne
>
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Re: Fwd: Get started with XWiki

vmassol
Administrator
FYI we dropped the installer because it was a pain to maintain and causing too much trouble (FTR izpack allowed to bundled the JRE too).

I’m not sure a this stage we should go back to that.

Here’s an idea:
* Merge Try and Download on xwiki.org into a single entry point
* Have a wizard in that entry point and ask some questions to the user (with the option to skip the wizard) to direct the user to use the right distribution for him/her.
* Thus, promote more the cloud option for users who are not technical and want a quick way to test xwiki.

It wouldn’t solve everything for sure but maybe it would help?

Thanks
-Vincent

> On 14 May 2018, at 11:32, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> There seem to be some resources on the topic:
>
> https://github.com/libgdx/libgdx/wiki/Bundling-a-JRE
> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/7071133/how-to-bundle-a-jre-with-launch4j
> https://codeiseasy.wordpress.com/2012/07/31/including-a-jre-in-a-tycho-build/
>
> ...so it's not such an uncommon practice.
>
> On the legal side, OpenJDK should be the obvious choice:
> https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/4824/is-it-legal-to-bundle-oracles-jre-with-an-open-source-program/4826
>
> IMO, it would make sense to provide the full and ready to test package,
> rather than an only 90% ready to test one.
>
> Thanks,
> Eduard
>
> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Thomas Mortagne <[hidden email]
>> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:49 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>> AFAIR, Eclipse also does this (i.e. bundle their own JRE), we could look
>>> into how they do it.
>>
>> Eclipse JDT comes with its own Java compiler but you are supposed to
>> install Java to run Eclipse itself.
>>
>>>
>>> On a quick check, OpenJDK's JRE is only 38.4 MB (
>>> http://jdk.java.net/java-se-ri/8) ... I find that acceptable.
>>
>> Not sure the license allow us to embbed what's on that page.
>>
>> 38.4MB is probably only for one system, I think you need 3 of those
>> (Linux, Windows, Mac)
>>
>>>
>>> FTR, the JDK is 164 MB.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Eduard
>>>
>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:40 AM, Thomas Mortagne <
>> [hidden email]
>>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> One issue with embedded Java (OpenJDK I guess) is that it would make
>>>> the zip quite huge.
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:30 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> On the palliative side (i.e. not actually fixing, but at least making
>>>> life
>>>>> a bit easier), we might consider a naming scheme for the downloadable
>>>> that
>>>>> includes that supported java version, e.g. xwiki-10.3-java8.zip
>> (though
>>>>> this might also lead users to thinking that the java 8 runtime is
>>>>> included... which might not be that bad of an idea, if we think about
>>>> it...
>>>>> at least for the zip version that is for demo purposes, which already
>>>>> contains the web server, the database, but still expects the user to
>>>>> understand and install the correct Java runtime, which makes no
>> sense.)
>>>>>
>>>>> So, yeah... TL;DR: add the java8 runtime to the .zip package and make
>>>> life
>>>>> easier for everyone. Optionally (though not sure if needed anymore,
>> if we
>>>>> bundle it), include it in the .zip file name.
>>>>>
>>>>> Of course, the production install, if done manually (i.e. not through
>>>>> .deb/.rpm packages), expects that the user reads the documentation.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Eduard
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:19 AM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ideas?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>> -Vincent
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Begin forwarded message:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> From: Vincent Massol
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
>>>>>>> Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
>>>>>>> To: XXX
>>>>>>> Cc: XXX
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Christian,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It's not working.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an
>>>>>> expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart' users,
>>>> not
>>>>>> experts.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s
>> easy
>>>>>> and you have nothing to do.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Which distribution did you choose and use?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And there is no help from the website.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Oracle Linux 7.
>>>>>>>> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP
>> Fri
>>>>>> May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
>>>>>>>> Java 10
>>>>>>>> Xwiki 10.3
>>>>>>>> tomcat.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully
>>>> working
>>>>>> with Java 9.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the
>>>>>> distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be
>>>> dropped
>>>>>> in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a
>>>> place
>>>>>> where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener
>>>> that
>>>>>> would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would
>> say
>>>> at
>>>>>> the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that
>>>> wouldn’t
>>>>>> be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback
>> from
>>>>>> users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java
>> 9
>>>> and
>>>>>> 10.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You need to read the installation page ;)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>>>>>> AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
>>>>>>> http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>>>>>> AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Here is the error:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>>>>>> colorThemeInit.vm
>>>>>>>> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>>>>>> colorThemeInit.vm
>>>>>>>> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while
>>>>>> evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
>> found
>>>>>> for reverse order comparator!
>>>>>>>>     at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>>>>>> java:276)
>>>>>>>>     ... 249 mor
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [snip
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
>> found
>>>>>> for reverse order comparator!
>>>>>>>>     at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>>>>>> java:276)
>>>>>>>>     ... 249 mor
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not
>>>> compatible
>>>>>> with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss
>>>>>> Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably
>>>> just
>>>>>> need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses
>>>> JBoss
>>>>>> Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of
>> using
>>>>>> XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an
>>>> issue
>>>>>> for it and work to make it work.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not
>>>> the
>>>>>> right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we
>> have a
>>>>>> user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by
>>>> trying
>>>>>> with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently
>> work
>>>>>> with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the
>>>> positive
>>>>>> side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you
>> will
>>>>>> transform your negative experience into a positive one, by
>> contributing
>>>> to
>>>>>> the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>> -Vincent Massol
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Thomas Mortagne
>>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Thomas Mortagne
>>

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Re: Fwd: Get started with XWiki

Eduard Moraru
On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 12:46 PM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]> wrote:

> FYI we dropped the installer because it was a pain to maintain and causing
> too much trouble (FTR izpack allowed to bundled the JRE too).
>
> I’m not sure a this stage we should go back to that.
>

FTR, I never suggested adding an installer, just including in the ZIP an
already available JDK.

Thanks,
Eduard

>
> Here’s an idea:
> * Merge Try and Download on xwiki.org into a single entry point
> * Have a wizard in that entry point and ask some questions to the user
> (with the option to skip the wizard) to direct the user to use the right
> distribution for him/her.
> * Thus, promote more the cloud option for users who are not technical and
> want a quick way to test xwiki.
>
> It wouldn’t solve everything for sure but maybe it would help?
>
> Thanks
> -Vincent
>
> > On 14 May 2018, at 11:32, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > There seem to be some resources on the topic:
> >
> > https://github.com/libgdx/libgdx/wiki/Bundling-a-JRE
> > https://stackoverflow.com/questions/7071133/how-to-
> bundle-a-jre-with-launch4j
> > https://codeiseasy.wordpress.com/2012/07/31/including-a-
> jre-in-a-tycho-build/
> >
> > ...so it's not such an uncommon practice.
> >
> > On the legal side, OpenJDK should be the obvious choice:
> > https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/
> 4824/is-it-legal-to-bundle-oracles-jre-with-an-open-source-program/4826
> >
> > IMO, it would make sense to provide the full and ready to test package,
> > rather than an only 90% ready to test one.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Eduard
> >
> > On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Thomas Mortagne <
> [hidden email]
> >> wrote:
> >
> >> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:49 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
> >> wrote:
> >>> AFAIR, Eclipse also does this (i.e. bundle their own JRE), we could
> look
> >>> into how they do it.
> >>
> >> Eclipse JDT comes with its own Java compiler but you are supposed to
> >> install Java to run Eclipse itself.
> >>
> >>>
> >>> On a quick check, OpenJDK's JRE is only 38.4 MB (
> >>> http://jdk.java.net/java-se-ri/8) ... I find that acceptable.
> >>
> >> Not sure the license allow us to embbed what's on that page.
> >>
> >> 38.4MB is probably only for one system, I think you need 3 of those
> >> (Linux, Windows, Mac)
> >>
> >>>
> >>> FTR, the JDK is 164 MB.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>> Eduard
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:40 AM, Thomas Mortagne <
> >> [hidden email]
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> One issue with embedded Java (OpenJDK I guess) is that it would make
> >>>> the zip quite huge.
> >>>>
> >>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:30 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]
> >
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>> Hi,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On the palliative side (i.e. not actually fixing, but at least making
> >>>> life
> >>>>> a bit easier), we might consider a naming scheme for the downloadable
> >>>> that
> >>>>> includes that supported java version, e.g. xwiki-10.3-java8.zip
> >> (though
> >>>>> this might also lead users to thinking that the java 8 runtime is
> >>>>> included... which might not be that bad of an idea, if we think about
> >>>> it...
> >>>>> at least for the zip version that is for demo purposes, which already
> >>>>> contains the web server, the database, but still expects the user to
> >>>>> understand and install the correct Java runtime, which makes no
> >> sense.)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> So, yeah... TL;DR: add the java8 runtime to the .zip package and make
> >>>> life
> >>>>> easier for everyone. Optionally (though not sure if needed anymore,
> >> if we
> >>>>> bundle it), include it in the .zip file name.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Of course, the production install, if done manually (i.e. not through
> >>>>> .deb/.rpm packages), expects that the user reads the documentation.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks,
> >>>>> Eduard
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:19 AM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]
> >
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Ideas?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks
> >>>>>> -Vincent
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Begin forwarded message:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> From: Vincent Massol
> >>>>>>> Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
> >>>>>>> Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
> >>>>>>> To: XXX
> >>>>>>> Cc: XXX
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Hi Christian,
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> It's not working.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an
> >>>>>> expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart'
> users,
> >>>> not
> >>>>>> experts.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s
> >> easy
> >>>>>> and you have nothing to do.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Which distribution did you choose and use?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> And there is no help from the website.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Oracle Linux 7.
> >>>>>>>> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP
> >> Fri
> >>>>>> May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
> >>>>>>>> Java 10
> >>>>>>>> Xwiki 10.3
> >>>>>>>> tomcat.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully
> >>>> working
> >>>>>> with Java 9.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the
> >>>>>> distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be
> >>>> dropped
> >>>>>> in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a
> >>>> place
> >>>>>> where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener
> >>>> that
> >>>>>> would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would
> >> say
> >>>> at
> >>>>>> the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that
> >>>> wouldn’t
> >>>>>> be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback
> >> from
> >>>>>> users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java
> >> 9
> >>>> and
> >>>>>> 10.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> You need to read the installation page ;)
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
> >>>>>> AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
> >>>>>>> http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
> >>>>>> AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Here is the error:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
> >>>>>> colorThemeInit.vm
> >>>>>>>> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
> >>>>>> colorThemeInit.vm
> >>>>>>>> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while
> >>>>>> evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> [snip]
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
> >> found
> >>>>>> for reverse order comparator!
> >>>>>>>>     at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
> >>>>>> java:276)
> >>>>>>>>     ... 249 mor
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> [snip
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
> >> found
> >>>>>> for reverse order comparator!
> >>>>>>>>     at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
> >>>>>> java:276)
> >>>>>>>>     ... 249 mor
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not
> >>>> compatible
> >>>>>> with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss
> >>>>>> Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably
> >>>> just
> >>>>>> need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses
> >>>> JBoss
> >>>>>> Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of
> >> using
> >>>>>> XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an
> >>>> issue
> >>>>>> for it and work to make it work.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not
> >>>> the
> >>>>>> right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we
> >> have a
> >>>>>> user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by
> >>>> trying
> >>>>>> with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently
> >> work
> >>>>>> with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the
> >>>> positive
> >>>>>> side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you
> >> will
> >>>>>> transform your negative experience into a positive one, by
> >> contributing
> >>>> to
> >>>>>> the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Thanks
> >>>>>>> -Vincent Massol
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> [snip]
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Thomas Mortagne
> >>>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Thomas Mortagne
> >>
>
>
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Re: Fwd: Get started with XWiki

vmassol
Administrator


> On 14 May 2018, at 14:13, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 12:46 PM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> FYI we dropped the installer because it was a pain to maintain and causing
>> too much trouble (FTR izpack allowed to bundled the JRE too).
>>
>> I’m not sure a this stage we should go back to that.
>>
>
> FTR, I never suggested adding an installer, just including in the ZIP an
> already available JDK.

I thought a JRE had to be installed. Are you really sure it doesn’t have to?

Thanks
-Vincent

>
> Thanks,
> Eduard
>
>>
>> Here’s an idea:
>> * Merge Try and Download on xwiki.org into a single entry point
>> * Have a wizard in that entry point and ask some questions to the user
>> (with the option to skip the wizard) to direct the user to use the right
>> distribution for him/her.
>> * Thus, promote more the cloud option for users who are not technical and
>> want a quick way to test xwiki.
>>
>> It wouldn’t solve everything for sure but maybe it would help?
>>
>> Thanks
>> -Vincent
>>
>>> On 14 May 2018, at 11:32, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> There seem to be some resources on the topic:
>>>
>>> https://github.com/libgdx/libgdx/wiki/Bundling-a-JRE
>>> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/7071133/how-to-
>> bundle-a-jre-with-launch4j
>>> https://codeiseasy.wordpress.com/2012/07/31/including-a-
>> jre-in-a-tycho-build/
>>>
>>> ...so it's not such an uncommon practice.
>>>
>>> On the legal side, OpenJDK should be the obvious choice:
>>> https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/
>> 4824/is-it-legal-to-bundle-oracles-jre-with-an-open-source-program/4826
>>>
>>> IMO, it would make sense to provide the full and ready to test package,
>>> rather than an only 90% ready to test one.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Eduard
>>>
>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Thomas Mortagne <
>> [hidden email]
>>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:49 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> AFAIR, Eclipse also does this (i.e. bundle their own JRE), we could
>> look
>>>>> into how they do it.
>>>>
>>>> Eclipse JDT comes with its own Java compiler but you are supposed to
>>>> install Java to run Eclipse itself.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On a quick check, OpenJDK's JRE is only 38.4 MB (
>>>>> http://jdk.java.net/java-se-ri/8) ... I find that acceptable.
>>>>
>>>> Not sure the license allow us to embbed what's on that page.
>>>>
>>>> 38.4MB is probably only for one system, I think you need 3 of those
>>>> (Linux, Windows, Mac)
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> FTR, the JDK is 164 MB.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Eduard
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:40 AM, Thomas Mortagne <
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> One issue with embedded Java (OpenJDK I guess) is that it would make
>>>>>> the zip quite huge.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:30 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]
>>>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On the palliative side (i.e. not actually fixing, but at least making
>>>>>> life
>>>>>>> a bit easier), we might consider a naming scheme for the downloadable
>>>>>> that
>>>>>>> includes that supported java version, e.g. xwiki-10.3-java8.zip
>>>> (though
>>>>>>> this might also lead users to thinking that the java 8 runtime is
>>>>>>> included... which might not be that bad of an idea, if we think about
>>>>>> it...
>>>>>>> at least for the zip version that is for demo purposes, which already
>>>>>>> contains the web server, the database, but still expects the user to
>>>>>>> understand and install the correct Java runtime, which makes no
>>>> sense.)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So, yeah... TL;DR: add the java8 runtime to the .zip package and make
>>>>>> life
>>>>>>> easier for everyone. Optionally (though not sure if needed anymore,
>>>> if we
>>>>>>> bundle it), include it in the .zip file name.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Of course, the production install, if done manually (i.e. not through
>>>>>>> .deb/.rpm packages), expects that the user reads the documentation.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>> Eduard
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:19 AM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]
>>>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ideas?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>> -Vincent
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Begin forwarded message:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> From: Vincent Massol
>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
>>>>>>>>> Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
>>>>>>>>> To: XXX
>>>>>>>>> Cc: XXX
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hi Christian,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> It's not working.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an
>>>>>>>> expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart'
>> users,
>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>> experts.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s
>>>> easy
>>>>>>>> and you have nothing to do.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Which distribution did you choose and use?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> And there is no help from the website.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Oracle Linux 7.
>>>>>>>>>> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP
>>>> Fri
>>>>>>>> May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
>>>>>>>>>> Java 10
>>>>>>>>>> Xwiki 10.3
>>>>>>>>>> tomcat.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully
>>>>>> working
>>>>>>>> with Java 9.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the
>>>>>>>> distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be
>>>>>> dropped
>>>>>>>> in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a
>>>>>> place
>>>>>>>> where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener
>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would
>>>> say
>>>>>> at
>>>>>>>> the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that
>>>>>> wouldn’t
>>>>>>>> be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback
>>>> from
>>>>>>>> users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java
>>>> 9
>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> 10.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> You need to read the installation page ;)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>>>>>>>> AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
>>>>>>>>> http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>>>>>>>> AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Here is the error:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>>>>>>>> colorThemeInit.vm
>>>>>>>>>> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>>>>>>>> colorThemeInit.vm
>>>>>>>>>> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while
>>>>>>>> evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
>>>> found
>>>>>>>> for reverse order comparator!
>>>>>>>>>>    at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>>>>>>>> java:276)
>>>>>>>>>>    ... 249 mor
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> [snip
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
>>>> found
>>>>>>>> for reverse order comparator!
>>>>>>>>>>    at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>>>>>>>> java:276)
>>>>>>>>>>    ... 249 mor
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not
>>>>>> compatible
>>>>>>>> with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss
>>>>>>>> Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably
>>>>>> just
>>>>>>>> need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses
>>>>>> JBoss
>>>>>>>> Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of
>>>> using
>>>>>>>> XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an
>>>>>> issue
>>>>>>>> for it and work to make it work.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we
>>>> have a
>>>>>>>> user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by
>>>>>> trying
>>>>>>>> with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently
>>>> work
>>>>>>>> with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the
>>>>>> positive
>>>>>>>> side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you
>>>> will
>>>>>>>> transform your negative experience into a positive one, by
>>>> contributing
>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>> -Vincent Massol
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Thomas Mortagne
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Thomas Mortagne
>>>>
>>
>>

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Re: Fwd: Get started with XWiki

Thomas Mortagne
Administrator
On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 2:57 PM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
>> On 14 May 2018, at 14:13, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 12:46 PM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> FYI we dropped the installer because it was a pain to maintain and causing
>>> too much trouble (FTR izpack allowed to bundled the JRE too).
>>>
>>> I’m not sure a this stage we should go back to that.
>>>
>>
>> FTR, I never suggested adding an installer, just including in the ZIP an
>> already available JDK.
>
> I thought a JRE had to be installed. Are you really sure it doesn’t have to?

I really doubt you have to install it. You certainly don't on Linux
(and I guess it's the same on Mac), I'm not 100% sure for Window but I
don't see why this would be required.

>
> Thanks
> -Vincent
>
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Eduard
>>
>>>
>>> Here’s an idea:
>>> * Merge Try and Download on xwiki.org into a single entry point
>>> * Have a wizard in that entry point and ask some questions to the user
>>> (with the option to skip the wizard) to direct the user to use the right
>>> distribution for him/her.
>>> * Thus, promote more the cloud option for users who are not technical and
>>> want a quick way to test xwiki.
>>>
>>> It wouldn’t solve everything for sure but maybe it would help?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>> -Vincent
>>>
>>>> On 14 May 2018, at 11:32, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> There seem to be some resources on the topic:
>>>>
>>>> https://github.com/libgdx/libgdx/wiki/Bundling-a-JRE
>>>> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/7071133/how-to-
>>> bundle-a-jre-with-launch4j
>>>> https://codeiseasy.wordpress.com/2012/07/31/including-a-
>>> jre-in-a-tycho-build/
>>>>
>>>> ...so it's not such an uncommon practice.
>>>>
>>>> On the legal side, OpenJDK should be the obvious choice:
>>>> https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/
>>> 4824/is-it-legal-to-bundle-oracles-jre-with-an-open-source-program/4826
>>>>
>>>> IMO, it would make sense to provide the full and ready to test package,
>>>> rather than an only 90% ready to test one.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Eduard
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Thomas Mortagne <
>>> [hidden email]
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:49 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> AFAIR, Eclipse also does this (i.e. bundle their own JRE), we could
>>> look
>>>>>> into how they do it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Eclipse JDT comes with its own Java compiler but you are supposed to
>>>>> install Java to run Eclipse itself.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On a quick check, OpenJDK's JRE is only 38.4 MB (
>>>>>> http://jdk.java.net/java-se-ri/8) ... I find that acceptable.
>>>>>
>>>>> Not sure the license allow us to embbed what's on that page.
>>>>>
>>>>> 38.4MB is probably only for one system, I think you need 3 of those
>>>>> (Linux, Windows, Mac)
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> FTR, the JDK is 164 MB.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>> Eduard
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:40 AM, Thomas Mortagne <
>>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> One issue with embedded Java (OpenJDK I guess) is that it would make
>>>>>>> the zip quite huge.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:30 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]
>>>>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On the palliative side (i.e. not actually fixing, but at least making
>>>>>>> life
>>>>>>>> a bit easier), we might consider a naming scheme for the downloadable
>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> includes that supported java version, e.g. xwiki-10.3-java8.zip
>>>>> (though
>>>>>>>> this might also lead users to thinking that the java 8 runtime is
>>>>>>>> included... which might not be that bad of an idea, if we think about
>>>>>>> it...
>>>>>>>> at least for the zip version that is for demo purposes, which already
>>>>>>>> contains the web server, the database, but still expects the user to
>>>>>>>> understand and install the correct Java runtime, which makes no
>>>>> sense.)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So, yeah... TL;DR: add the java8 runtime to the .zip package and make
>>>>>>> life
>>>>>>>> easier for everyone. Optionally (though not sure if needed anymore,
>>>>> if we
>>>>>>>> bundle it), include it in the .zip file name.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Of course, the production install, if done manually (i.e. not through
>>>>>>>> .deb/.rpm packages), expects that the user reads the documentation.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>> Eduard
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:19 AM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]
>>>>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Ideas?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>> -Vincent
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Begin forwarded message:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> From: Vincent Massol
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
>>>>>>>>>> Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
>>>>>>>>>> To: XXX
>>>>>>>>>> Cc: XXX
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi Christian,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> It's not working.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an
>>>>>>>>> expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart'
>>> users,
>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>>> experts.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s
>>>>> easy
>>>>>>>>> and you have nothing to do.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Which distribution did you choose and use?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> And there is no help from the website.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Oracle Linux 7.
>>>>>>>>>>> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP
>>>>> Fri
>>>>>>>>> May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
>>>>>>>>>>> Java 10
>>>>>>>>>>> Xwiki 10.3
>>>>>>>>>>> tomcat.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully
>>>>>>> working
>>>>>>>>> with Java 9.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the
>>>>>>>>> distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be
>>>>>>> dropped
>>>>>>>>> in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a
>>>>>>> place
>>>>>>>>> where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener
>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>> would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would
>>>>> say
>>>>>>> at
>>>>>>>>> the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that
>>>>>>> wouldn’t
>>>>>>>>> be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback
>>>>> from
>>>>>>>>> users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java
>>>>> 9
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>> 10.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> You need to read the installation page ;)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>>>>>>>>> AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>>>>>>>>> AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Here is the error:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>>>>>>>>> colorThemeInit.vm
>>>>>>>>>>> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>>>>>>>>> colorThemeInit.vm
>>>>>>>>>>> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while
>>>>>>>>> evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
>>>>> found
>>>>>>>>> for reverse order comparator!
>>>>>>>>>>>    at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>>>>>>>>> java:276)
>>>>>>>>>>>    ... 249 mor
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> [snip
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
>>>>> found
>>>>>>>>> for reverse order comparator!
>>>>>>>>>>>    at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>>>>>>>>> java:276)
>>>>>>>>>>>    ... 249 mor
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not
>>>>>>> compatible
>>>>>>>>> with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss
>>>>>>>>> Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably
>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>>>> need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses
>>>>>>> JBoss
>>>>>>>>> Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of
>>>>> using
>>>>>>>>> XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an
>>>>>>> issue
>>>>>>>>> for it and work to make it work.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we
>>>>> have a
>>>>>>>>> user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by
>>>>>>> trying
>>>>>>>>> with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently
>>>>> work
>>>>>>>>> with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the
>>>>>>> positive
>>>>>>>>> side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you
>>>>> will
>>>>>>>>> transform your negative experience into a positive one, by
>>>>> contributing
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>>> -Vincent Massol
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Thomas Mortagne
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Thomas Mortagne
>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>



--
Thomas Mortagne
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Re: Fwd: Get started with XWiki

vmassol
Administrator


> On 14 May 2018, at 15:30, Thomas Mortagne <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 2:57 PM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> On 14 May 2018, at 14:13, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 12:46 PM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> FYI we dropped the installer because it was a pain to maintain and causing
>>>> too much trouble (FTR izpack allowed to bundled the JRE too).
>>>>
>>>> I’m not sure a this stage we should go back to that.
>>>>
>>>
>>> FTR, I never suggested adding an installer, just including in the ZIP an
>>> already available JDK.
>>
>> I thought a JRE had to be installed. Are you really sure it doesn’t have to?
>
> I really doubt you have to install it. You certainly don't on Linux
> (and I guess it's the same on Mac),

I’ve always installed on mac…

Thanks
-Vincent

> I'm not 100% sure for Window but I
> don't see why this would be required.
>
>>
>> Thanks
>> -Vincent
>>
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Eduard
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Here’s an idea:
>>>> * Merge Try and Download on xwiki.org into a single entry point
>>>> * Have a wizard in that entry point and ask some questions to the user
>>>> (with the option to skip the wizard) to direct the user to use the right
>>>> distribution for him/her.
>>>> * Thus, promote more the cloud option for users who are not technical and
>>>> want a quick way to test xwiki.
>>>>
>>>> It wouldn’t solve everything for sure but maybe it would help?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks
>>>> -Vincent
>>>>
>>>>> On 14 May 2018, at 11:32, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> There seem to be some resources on the topic:
>>>>>
>>>>> https://github.com/libgdx/libgdx/wiki/Bundling-a-JRE
>>>>> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/7071133/how-to-
>>>> bundle-a-jre-with-launch4j
>>>>> https://codeiseasy.wordpress.com/2012/07/31/including-a-
>>>> jre-in-a-tycho-build/
>>>>>
>>>>> ...so it's not such an uncommon practice.
>>>>>
>>>>> On the legal side, OpenJDK should be the obvious choice:
>>>>> https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/
>>>> 4824/is-it-legal-to-bundle-oracles-jre-with-an-open-source-program/4826
>>>>>
>>>>> IMO, it would make sense to provide the full and ready to test package,
>>>>> rather than an only 90% ready to test one.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>> Eduard
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Thomas Mortagne <
>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:49 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> AFAIR, Eclipse also does this (i.e. bundle their own JRE), we could
>>>> look
>>>>>>> into how they do it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Eclipse JDT comes with its own Java compiler but you are supposed to
>>>>>> install Java to run Eclipse itself.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On a quick check, OpenJDK's JRE is only 38.4 MB (
>>>>>>> http://jdk.java.net/java-se-ri/8) ... I find that acceptable.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Not sure the license allow us to embbed what's on that page.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 38.4MB is probably only for one system, I think you need 3 of those
>>>>>> (Linux, Windows, Mac)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> FTR, the JDK is 164 MB.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>> Eduard
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 11:40 AM, Thomas Mortagne <
>>>>>> [hidden email]
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> One issue with embedded Java (OpenJDK I guess) is that it would make
>>>>>>>> the zip quite huge.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:30 AM, Eduard Moraru <[hidden email]
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On the palliative side (i.e. not actually fixing, but at least making
>>>>>>>> life
>>>>>>>>> a bit easier), we might consider a naming scheme for the downloadable
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>> includes that supported java version, e.g. xwiki-10.3-java8.zip
>>>>>> (though
>>>>>>>>> this might also lead users to thinking that the java 8 runtime is
>>>>>>>>> included... which might not be that bad of an idea, if we think about
>>>>>>>> it...
>>>>>>>>> at least for the zip version that is for demo purposes, which already
>>>>>>>>> contains the web server, the database, but still expects the user to
>>>>>>>>> understand and install the correct Java runtime, which makes no
>>>>>> sense.)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So, yeah... TL;DR: add the java8 runtime to the .zip package and make
>>>>>>>> life
>>>>>>>>> easier for everyone. Optionally (though not sure if needed anymore,
>>>>>> if we
>>>>>>>>> bundle it), include it in the .zip file name.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Of course, the production install, if done manually (i.e. not through
>>>>>>>>> .deb/.rpm packages), expects that the user reads the documentation.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>> Eduard
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 10:19 AM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi devs, here’s a feedback we received, FYI.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Ideas?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>>> -Vincent
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Begin forwarded message:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> From: Vincent Massol
>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: Get started with XWiki
>>>>>>>>>>> Date: 14 May 2018 at 09:10:06 CEST
>>>>>>>>>>> To: XXX
>>>>>>>>>>> Cc: XXX
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Christian,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 12 May 2018, at 14:25, Christian XXX wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> It's not working.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> And as usual ith java, the log does not help. Maybe if I were an
>>>>>>>>>> expert? But an app is supposed to be installed by just 'smart'
>>>> users,
>>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>>>> experts.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> If you choose the easy installation methods we propose then it’s
>>>>>> easy
>>>>>>>>>> and you have nothing to do.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Which distribution did you choose and use?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> And there is no help from the website.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Oracle Linux 7.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Linux localhost.localdomain 4.1.12-124.14.5.el7uek.x86_64 #2 SMP
>>>>>> Fri
>>>>>>>>>> May 4 15:26:53 PDT 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
>>>>>>>>>>>> Java 10
>>>>>>>>>>>> Xwiki 10.3
>>>>>>>>>>>> tomcat.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> If it is not compatible whith this java. It should not install.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> It’s just not been tested with Java 10 yet. It’s not even fully
>>>>>>>> working
>>>>>>>>>> with Java 9.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Note that it’s hard to check for the java version for all the
>>>>>>>>>> distributions since XWiki is a webapp and the XWiki WAR can just be
>>>>>>>> dropped
>>>>>>>>>> in a servlet container and thus we don’t have a startup script and a
>>>>>>>> place
>>>>>>>>>> where we can put a check. All we could do is have a Servlet Listener
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>> would emit a big stack trace (like the one you got) and that would
>>>>>> say
>>>>>>>> at
>>>>>>>>>> the innermost level that XWiki requires Java <= 8. But even that
>>>>>>>> wouldn’t
>>>>>>>>>> be good since it would prevent testing in Java 9+. We want feedback
>>>>>> from
>>>>>>>>>> users about what works/what doesn’t work so improve support for Java
>>>>>> 9
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>> 10.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> If it is compatible with only one version of java, which one?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> You need to read the installation page ;)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> See http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>>>>>>>>>> AdminGuide/Installation/ and especially:
>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Documentation/
>>>>>>>>>> AdminGuide/Installation/#HHardwareandSoftwarerequirements
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Here is the error:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>>>>>>>>>> colorThemeInit.vm
>>>>>>>>>>>> Error number 4001 in 4: Error while evaluating velocity template
>>>>>>>>>> colorThemeInit.vm
>>>>>>>>>>>> com.xpn.xwiki.XWikiException: Error number 4001 in 4: Error while
>>>>>>>>>> evaluating velocity template colorThemeInit.vm
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
>>>>>> found
>>>>>>>>>> for reverse order comparator!
>>>>>>>>>>>>   at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>>>>>>>>>> java:276)
>>>>>>>>>>>>   ... 249 mor
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> [snip
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Caused by: java.lang.IllegalStateException: No standard field
>>>>>> found
>>>>>>>>>> for reverse order comparator!
>>>>>>>>>>>>   at org.jboss.marshalling.river.Protocol.<clinit>(Protocol.
>>>>>>>>>> java:276)
>>>>>>>>>>>>   ... 249 mor
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> What this says is that JBoss Infinispan (which we use) is not
>>>>>>>> compatible
>>>>>>>>>> with Java 10. Apparently this is fixed in recent version of JBoss
>>>>>>>>>> Marshalling: https://issues.jboss.org/browse/JBMAR-216. We probably
>>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>>>>> need to wait for JBoss Infinispan to release a new version that uses
>>>>>>>> JBoss
>>>>>>>>>> Marshalling 2.1.0.Final.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> What would be awesome would be for you to report the problem of
>>>>>> using
>>>>>>>>>> XWiki with Java 10 on https://jira.xwiki.org so that we can have an
>>>>>>>> issue
>>>>>>>>>> for it and work to make it work.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Note that I’m replying to this message to help you out but it’s not
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> right place to post a question and get help normally. For that we
>>>>>> have a
>>>>>>>>>> user forum at https://forum.xwiki.org/.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I’m sorry you had some issues. OTOH you’re looking for trouble by
>>>>>>>> trying
>>>>>>>>>> with Java 10. There are very few (if any!) java app that currently
>>>>>> work
>>>>>>>>>> with Java 9 and 10. You’d be much better off using Java 8. On the
>>>>>>>> positive
>>>>>>>>>> side, if you raise the issue on https://jira.xwiki.org, then you
>>>>>> will
>>>>>>>>>> transform your negative experience into a positive one, by
>>>>>> contributing
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>> the development of XWiki and helping out future users.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>>>> -Vincent Massol
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Thomas Mortagne
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Thomas Mortagne
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Thomas Mortagne