Selecting a tool to manage localization

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Selecting a tool to manage localization

Ludovic Dubost

Hi team,

I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we could
have for XWiki comparing:

- a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
- an L10N app I started to build
- using launchpad.net

http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization

Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have not been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and evaluate them in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net could work for us.

Let's discuss.

Ludovic

--
Ludovic Dubost
Blog: http://blog.ludovic.org/
XWiki: http://www.xwiki.com
Skype: ldubost GTalk: ldubost


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Re: Selecting a tool to manage localization

vmassol
Administrator

On Oct 31, 2008, at 2:05 AM, Ludovic Dubost wrote:

>
> Hi team,
>
> I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we  
> could have for XWiki comparing:
>
> - a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
> - an L10N app I started to build
> - using launchpad.net
>
> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization
>
> Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have  
> not been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and  
> evaluate them in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net  
> could work for us.
>
> Let's discuss.

What would be the process of committing the modified translations to  
our SVN with launchpad.net? Is launchpad.net customizable easily to  
modify that?

Some ideas of how we could integrate it with our SVN:

1) Using JIRA.

Note: What they do in maven land is the following (for publishing  
artifacts to the central repo):
* A JIRA project.
* Then they have a script that reads the attached files directly from  
JIRA and apply them

So we could have something like:
* Automatically create a jira issue with a patch attached
* Have a tool that reads the jira issues and apply the patches (btw  
this could be generic to any type of jira patches)

2) Another solution would be to use Git and merge Git branches into  
our svn trunk. This is very easy to do with Git. The downside is that  
our contributors will not be technical so Git would be too complex for  
them.

3) Another solution would be to have the svn commit be made directly  
from the web application (by a committer). This means specifying the  
svn password when committing for ex.

4) Another solution would to have a special SVN server or project that  
has no passwords for committing and it's the users who commit directly  
to it using a username they provide. This would send a diff email to  
the list (as normal) and committers would do the review and commit the  
changes by doing a merge.

Thanks
-Vincent

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Re: Selecting a tool to manage localization

kaaloo
In reply to this post by Ludovic Dubost
Hi Ludo,

I have mentioned your work on #launchpad at irc.freenode.net and the
launchpad team is interested in helping out.  I have an "appointment"
to talk to danilos in about 2h so if you or Vincent are interested
maybe that would be a good opportunity to learn more.  I will report
back otherwise.

Some of the things you may want to think about:

- There is actually already an xwiki project in launchpad that I
created a long while back, danilos suggested that translation should
go through there

https://edge.launchpad.net/xwiki

- There is a way to group projects together in launchpad which would
take care of translations for the different components, applications
etc
- There is an api initiative, currently in beta, which could provide
an elegant way of meeting all of your requirements through mixing a
launchpad backend with a  lightweight xwiki app.  The api could help
out in automating SVN sync although it currently doesn't focus on
translation features but maybe its not too hard to put some features
like that on the roadmap.

https://help.launchpad.net/API

To my knowledge launchpad is going to be released as open source, but
is not there yet.

Luis

2008/10/31 Ludovic Dubost <[hidden email]>:

>
> Hi team,
>
> I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we could have
> for XWiki comparing:
>
> - a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
> - an L10N app I started to build
> - using launchpad.net
>
> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization
>
> Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have not
> been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and evaluate them
> in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net could work for us.
>
> Let's discuss.
>
> Ludovic
>
> --
> Ludovic Dubost
> Blog: http://blog.ludovic.org/
> XWiki: http://www.xwiki.com
> Skype: ldubost GTalk: ldubost
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> devs mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
>
>



--
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+33 6 14 20 87 93
skype : kaaloo
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Re: Selecting a tool to manage localization

Ludovic Dubost-2
In reply to this post by vmassol
Vincent Massol wrote:

> On Oct 31, 2008, at 2:05 AM, Ludovic Dubost wrote:
>
>  
>> Hi team,
>>
>> I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we  
>> could have for XWiki comparing:
>>
>> - a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
>> - an L10N app I started to build
>> - using launchpad.net
>>
>> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization
>>
>> Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have  
>> not been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and  
>> evaluate them in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net  
>> could work for us.
>>
>> Let's discuss.
>>    
>
> What would be the process of committing the modified translations to  
> our SVN with launchpad.net? Is launchpad.net customizable easily to  
> modify that?
>
>  
I think we would need some tools on our end to import/export data from
launchpad.net.

Launchpad uses gettext translations files (.po) which can be converted  
from/to java resources with some python tools. However the format is not
that complex and we could easily write our own converter.

For me the process is the same for launchpad.net or for an XWiki
application. We import regularly the english language file to launchpad.
We import once the other translations. Then we can have our build
process either pick up automatically the currently validated
translations files or we have a manual export and commit of the work
done on launchpad.

It would be the same for an XWiki based application. In this method the
application becomes the authoritative source for all translations and
direct commits to the translations files should be forbidden except the
english version.

Ludovic

> Some ideas of how we could integrate it with our SVN:
>
> 1) Using JIRA.
>
> Note: What they do in maven land is the following (for publishing  
> artifacts to the central repo):
> * A JIRA project.
> * Then they have a script that reads the attached files directly from  
> JIRA and apply them
>
> So we could have something like:
> * Automatically create a jira issue with a patch attached
> * Have a tool that reads the jira issues and apply the patches (btw  
> this could be generic to any type of jira patches)
>
> 2) Another solution would be to use Git and merge Git branches into  
> our svn trunk. This is very easy to do with Git. The downside is that  
> our contributors will not be technical so Git would be too complex for  
> them.
>
> 3) Another solution would be to have the svn commit be made directly  
> from the web application (by a committer). This means specifying the  
> svn password when committing for ex.
>
> 4) Another solution would to have a special SVN server or project that  
> has no passwords for committing and it's the users who commit directly  
> to it using a username they provide. This would send a diff email to  
> the list (as normal) and committers would do the review and commit the  
> changes by doing a merge.
>
> Thanks
> -Vincent
>
> _______________________________________________
> devs mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
>
>  


--
Ludovic Dubost
Blog: http://blog.ludovic.org/
XWiki: http://www.xwiki.com
Skype: ldubost GTalk: ldubost

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Re: Selecting a tool to manage localization

Ludovic Dubost-2
In reply to this post by kaaloo
Luis Arias wrote:

> Hi Ludo,
>
> I have mentioned your work on #launchpad at irc.freenode.net and the
> launchpad team is interested in helping out.  I have an "appointment"
> to talk to danilos in about 2h so if you or Vincent are interested
> maybe that would be a good opportunity to learn more.  I will report
> back otherwise.
>
> Some of the things you may want to think about:
>
> - There is actually already an xwiki project in launchpad that I
> created a long while back, danilos suggested that translation should
> go through there
>
> https://edge.launchpad.net/xwiki
>  

Let's use that one instead of the one I created.

> - There is a way to group projects together in launchpad which would
> take care of translations for the different components, applications
> etc
> - There is an api initiative, currently in beta, which could provide
> an elegant way of meeting all of your requirements through mixing a
> launchpad backend with a  lightweight xwiki app.  The api could help
> out in automating SVN sync although it currently doesn't focus on
> translation features but maybe its not too hard to put some features
> like that on the roadmap.
>  
> https://help.launchpad.net/API
>  
I'll check the API. We need to have sufficient access the export that
data programmatically if we want to import the english versions easily
and gather back the translations result easily.
> To my knowledge launchpad is going to be released as open source, but
> is not there yet.
>  

That could be a showstopper if we want to make sure we keep control.

> Luis
>
> 2008/10/31 Ludovic Dubost <[hidden email]>:
>  
>> Hi team,
>>
>> I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we could have
>> for XWiki comparing:
>>
>> - a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
>> - an L10N app I started to build
>> - using launchpad.net
>>
>> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization
>>
>> Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have not
>> been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and evaluate them
>> in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net could work for us.
>>
>> Let's discuss.
>>
>> Ludovic
>>
>> --
>> Ludovic Dubost
>> Blog: http://blog.ludovic.org/
>> XWiki: http://www.xwiki.com
>> Skype: ldubost GTalk: ldubost
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> devs mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
>>
>>
>>    
>
>
>
>  


--
Ludovic Dubost
Blog: http://blog.ludovic.org/
XWiki: http://www.xwiki.com
Skype: ldubost GTalk: ldubost

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Re: Selecting a tool to manage localization

Paul Libbrecht
In reply to this post by Ludovic Dubost
Dare I suggest to add the fundamental requirement to support re-
organization of resource-bundles? I am not sure I saw this explicitly  
in this list but maybe you can confirm it's there.

Basically, the need is as simple as that:
- version x+1 of the software is done, there's a few changes in the  
resources, some parts moved to other bundles
- translator is contacted to work on the translation and the merge  
tool applies the developer bundle organization (that includes all the  
moves) to his (or his language) previous files
- he can now work on the reorganized bundles without needing to port  
manually the copies

I've done a command-line-tool that does just that... but I think you  
want a whole lot more in the description there.

paul


Le 31-oct.-08 à 02:05, Ludovic Dubost a écrit :

> I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we  
> could have for XWiki comparing:
>
> - a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
> - an L10N app I started to build
> - using launchpad.net
>
> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization
>
> Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have  
> not been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and  
> evaluate them in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net  
> could work for us.

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Re: Selecting a tool to manage localization

Ludovic Dubost-2
Paul Libbrecht wrote:

> Dare I suggest to add the fundamental requirement to support
> re-organization of resource-bundles? I am not sure I saw this
> explicitly in this list but maybe you can confirm it's there.
>
> Basically, the need is as simple as that:
> - version x+1 of the software is done, there's a few changes in the
> resources, some parts moved to other bundles
> - translator is contacted to work on the translation and the merge
> tool applies the developer bundle organization (that includes all the
> moves) to his (or his language) previous files
> - he can now work on the reorganized bundles without needing to port
> manually the copies
>
> I've done a command-line-tool that does just that... but I think you
> want a whole lot more in the description there.
>
> paul
>
I think this is taken into account by the tool. When versions x was
already translated and validated, the tool says translations are up to date.
When version x+1 is done, the main language files are reloaded in the
tool. At this point, the tool will point out:

- all empty translations (new strings)
- all keys that have the main language text that has changed from the
previous version

The translator can work on these on the online site.

In the online tool approach, the online tool is the master for all
translations. Nobody shoud work directly on translations bundles.

Ludovic

>
> Le 31-oct.-08 à 02:05, Ludovic Dubost a écrit :
>> I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we could
>> have for XWiki comparing:
>>
>> - a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
>> - an L10N app I started to build
>> - using launchpad.net
>>
>> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization 
>>
>>
>> Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have
>> not been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and
>> evaluate them in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net
>> could work for us.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> devs mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
>  


--
Ludovic Dubost
Blog: http://blog.ludovic.org/
XWiki: http://www.xwiki.com
Skype: ldubost GTalk: ldubost

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Re: Selecting a tool to manage localization

Paul Libbrecht
Careful,

I really meant give flexibility for developers to move around sections  
of bundles... of course without translators re-translating. That  
doesn't seem to be taken care of.

One bad experience which made us completely disqualify 99translations  
which, I think, is similar to most only tools is the absence of  
sections and comments... e.g. "these phrases appear in this UI". This  
is really crucial!

paul


Le 04-nov.-08 à 01:23, Ludovic Dubost a écrit :

> I think this is taken into account by the tool. When versions x was
> already translated and validated, the tool says translations are up  
> to date.
> When version x+1 is done, the main language files are reloaded in the
> tool. At this point, the tool will point out:
>
> - all empty translations (new strings)
> - all keys that have the main language text that has changed from the
> previous version
>
> The translator can work on these on the online site.
>
> In the online tool approach, the online tool is the master for all
> translations. Nobody shoud work directly on translations bundles.

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Re: Selecting a tool to manage localization

Ludovic Dubost-2

You mean a developer renaming a key ?

Well the only way for this to be handled by the tool would be to have
the developer declare the key name is being changed. This could be done
but would need to be done in the tool, not in the initial bundle.

Ludovic

Paul Libbrecht wrote:

> Careful,
>
> I really meant give flexibility for developers to move around sections
> of bundles... of course without translators re-translating. That
> doesn't seem to be taken care of.
>
> One bad experience which made us completely disqualify 99translations
> which, I think, is similar to most only tools is the absence of
> sections and comments... e.g. "these phrases appear in this UI". This
> is really crucial!
>
> paul
>
>
> Le 04-nov.-08 à 01:23, Ludovic Dubost a écrit :
>
>> I think this is taken into account by the tool. When versions x was
>> already translated and validated, the tool says translations are up
>> to date.
>> When version x+1 is done, the main language files are reloaded in the
>> tool. At this point, the tool will point out:
>>
>> - all empty translations (new strings)
>> - all keys that have the main language text that has changed from the
>> previous version
>>
>> The translator can work on these on the online site.
>>
>> In the online tool approach, the online tool is the master for all
>> translations. Nobody shoud work directly on translations bundles.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> devs mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
>  


--
Ludovic Dubost
Blog: http://blog.ludovic.org/
XWiki: http://www.xwiki.com
Skype: ldubost GTalk: ldubost

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Re: Selecting a tool to manage localization

Paul Libbrecht

Le 04-nov.-08 à 02:08, Ludovic Dubost a écrit :
> You mean a developer renaming a key ?

I mean the developer *moving the key*.
For example he could move it to another file, or simply to another  
section of the source.

For the developer renaming a key, this is more difficult as you point  
out, but it may be worth that such an evolution tool has "automated  
suggestion coming from other parts" (but "please validate that  
suggestion you translator").

paul

> Well the only way for this to be handled by the tool would be to have
> the developer declare the key name is being changed. This could be  
> done
> but would need to be done in the tool, not in the initial bundle.


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[VOTE] Selecting a tool to manage localization

Ludovic Dubost-2
In reply to this post by Ludovic Dubost

Hi,

I think we need to move forward and get to a decision on our approach.

I've currently not been very convinced on the launchpad approach given
that it seems overly complex to get our translations loaded in their
system. The french translations I've been trying to load are blocked for
review (see https://translations.launchpad.net/xwiki/+imports ). Also I
don't see clearly where to get the source code for launchpad to have our
own install if we wanted, and how complex it would be given that
launchpad has many other features unrelated to translations.

On the other hand, I've improved the speed of the translation app on
http://l10n.myxwiki.org using counting caches and it seems to work quite
well.

So I would like to launch a vote to go with the XWiki translation
application approach and move it to it's own wiki on l10n.xwiki.org. We
also need this wiki to be UTF-8 in order to support translations in all
languages.

Here is my +1 for using l10n.myxwiki.org

Ludovic

Ludovic Dubost wrote:

>
> Hi team,
>
> I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we could
> have for XWiki comparing:
>
> - a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
> - an L10N app I started to build
> - using launchpad.net
>
> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization 
>
>
> Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have
> not been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and
> evaluate them in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net
> could work for us.
>
> Let's discuss.
>
> Ludovic
>
> _______________________________________________
> devs mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
>  


--
Ludovic Dubost
Blog: http://blog.ludovic.org/
XWiki: http://www.xwiki.com
Skype: ldubost GTalk: ldubost

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Re: [VOTE] Selecting a tool to manage localization

Marius Dumitru Florea
Ludovic Dubost wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I think we need to move forward and get to a decision on our approach.
>
> I've currently not been very convinced on the launchpad approach given
> that it seems overly complex to get our translations loaded in their
> system. The french translations I've been trying to load are blocked for
> review (see https://translations.launchpad.net/xwiki/+imports ). Also I
> don't see clearly where to get the source code for launchpad to have our
> own install if we wanted, and how complex it would be given that
> launchpad has many other features unrelated to translations.
>
> On the other hand, I've improved the speed of the translation app on
> http://l10n.myxwiki.org using counting caches and it seems to work quite
> well.
>
> So I would like to launch a vote to go with the XWiki translation
> application approach and move it to it's own wiki on l10n.xwiki.org. We
> also need this wiki to be UTF-8 in order to support translations in all
> languages.
>
> Here is my +1 for using l10n.myxwiki.org

+0

>
> Ludovic
>
> Ludovic Dubost wrote:
>> Hi team,
>>
>> I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we could
>> have for XWiki comparing:
>>
>> - a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
>> - an L10N app I started to build
>> - using launchpad.net
>>
>> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization 
>>
>>
>> Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have
>> not been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and
>> evaluate them in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net
>> could work for us.
>>
>> Let's discuss.
>>
>> Ludovic
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> devs mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
>>  
>
>
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Re: Selecting a tool to manage localization

Ludovic Dubost-2
In reply to this post by Paul Libbrecht

I think we can achieve both renaming and moving keys if we do this in
the tool and not directly in SVN files. The current level of information
given by the translations files won't currently allow the tool to detect
this from the translations files unless we extend the translation file
spec and add some info like that in the files.

I've been thinking we could make the translation tool the master for the
main language file also. Keys would have to be added there. In this case
we can also rename and move and then have a commit system or have the
build system pick up the files directly from there.

Ludovic

Paul Libbrecht wrote:

>
> Le 04-nov.-08 à 02:08, Ludovic Dubost a écrit :
>> You mean a developer renaming a key ?
>
> I mean the developer *moving the key*.
> For example he could move it to another file, or simply to another
> section of the source.
>
> For the developer renaming a key, this is more difficult as you point
> out, but it may be worth that such an evolution tool has "automated
> suggestion coming from other parts" (but "please validate that
> suggestion you translator").
>
> paul
>
>> Well the only way for this to be handled by the tool would be to have
>> the developer declare the key name is being changed. This could be done
>> but would need to be done in the tool, not in the initial bundle.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> devs mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
>  


--
Ludovic Dubost
Blog: http://blog.ludovic.org/
XWiki: http://www.xwiki.com
Skype: ldubost GTalk: ldubost

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Re: [VOTE] Selecting a tool to manage localization

Sergiu Dumitriu-2
In reply to this post by Ludovic Dubost-2
Ludovic Dubost wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I think we need to move forward and get to a decision on our approach.
>
> I've currently not been very convinced on the launchpad approach given
> that it seems overly complex to get our translations loaded in their
> system. The french translations I've been trying to load are blocked for
> review (see https://translations.launchpad.net/xwiki/+imports ). Also I
> don't see clearly where to get the source code for launchpad to have our
> own install if we wanted, and how complex it would be given that
> launchpad has many other features unrelated to translations.
>
> On the other hand, I've improved the speed of the translation app on
> http://l10n.myxwiki.org using counting caches and it seems to work quite
> well.
>
> So I would like to launch a vote to go with the XWiki translation
> application approach and move it to it's own wiki on l10n.xwiki.org. We
> also need this wiki to be UTF-8 in order to support translations in all
> languages.
>
> Here is my +1 for using l10n.myxwiki.org


+1 from me, too


> Ludovic
>
> Ludovic Dubost wrote:
>> Hi team,
>>
>> I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we could
>> have for XWiki comparing:
>>
>> - a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
>> - an L10N app I started to build
>> - using launchpad.net
>>
>> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization 
>>
>>
>> Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have
>> not been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and
>> evaluate them in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net
>> could work for us.
>>
>> Let's discuss.
>>
>> Ludovic


--
Sergiu Dumitriu
http://purl.org/net/sergiu/
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Re: [VOTE] Selecting a tool to manage localization

Ludovic Dubost-2
In reply to this post by Ludovic Dubost-2

Any -1 votes ? Or should we proceed on setting up our own l10n.xwiki.org
tool ?

Ludovic

Ludovic Dubost wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I think we need to move forward and get to a decision on our approach.
>
> I've currently not been very convinced on the launchpad approach given
> that it seems overly complex to get our translations loaded in their
> system. The french translations I've been trying to load are blocked for
> review (see https://translations.launchpad.net/xwiki/+imports ). Also I
> don't see clearly where to get the source code for launchpad to have our
> own install if we wanted, and how complex it would be given that
> launchpad has many other features unrelated to translations.
>
> On the other hand, I've improved the speed of the translation app on
> http://l10n.myxwiki.org using counting caches and it seems to work quite
> well.
>
> So I would like to launch a vote to go with the XWiki translation
> application approach and move it to it's own wiki on l10n.xwiki.org. We
> also need this wiki to be UTF-8 in order to support translations in all
> languages.
>
> Here is my +1 for using l10n.myxwiki.org
>
> Ludovic
>
> Ludovic Dubost wrote:
>  
>> Hi team,
>>
>> I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we could
>> have for XWiki comparing:
>>
>> - a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
>> - an L10N app I started to build
>> - using launchpad.net
>>
>> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization 
>>
>>
>> Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have
>> not been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and
>> evaluate them in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net
>> could work for us.
>>
>> Let's discuss.
>>
>> Ludovic
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> devs mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
>>  
>>    
>
>
>  


--
Ludovic Dubost
Blog: http://blog.ludovic.org/
XWiki: http://www.xwiki.com
Skype: ldubost GTalk: ldubost

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Re: [VOTE] Selecting a tool to manage localization

Sergiu Dumitriu-2
No -1 until now.

Ludovic Dubost wrote:

> Any -1 votes ? Or should we proceed on setting up our own l10n.xwiki.org
> tool ?
>
> Ludovic
>
> Ludovic Dubost wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I think we need to move forward and get to a decision on our approach.
>>
>> I've currently not been very convinced on the launchpad approach given
>> that it seems overly complex to get our translations loaded in their
>> system. The french translations I've been trying to load are blocked for
>> review (see https://translations.launchpad.net/xwiki/+imports ). Also I
>> don't see clearly where to get the source code for launchpad to have our
>> own install if we wanted, and how complex it would be given that
>> launchpad has many other features unrelated to translations.
>>
>> On the other hand, I've improved the speed of the translation app on
>> http://l10n.myxwiki.org using counting caches and it seems to work quite
>> well.
>>
>> So I would like to launch a vote to go with the XWiki translation
>> application approach and move it to it's own wiki on l10n.xwiki.org. We
>> also need this wiki to be UTF-8 in order to support translations in all
>> languages.
>>
>> Here is my +1 for using l10n.myxwiki.org
>>
>> Ludovic
>>
>> Ludovic Dubost wrote:
>>  
>>> Hi team,
>>>
>>> I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we could
>>> have for XWiki comparing:
>>>
>>> - a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
>>> - an L10N app I started to build
>>> - using launchpad.net
>>>
>>> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization 
>>>
>>>
>>> Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have
>>> not been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and
>>> evaluate them in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net
>>> could work for us.
>>>
>>> Let's discuss.
>>>
>>> Ludovic
>>>


--
Sergiu Dumitriu
http://purl.org/net/sergiu/
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Re: [VOTE] Selecting a tool to manage localization

vmassol
Administrator
In reply to this post by Ludovic Dubost-2
I've not thought enough about this (I wanted to do it but got swamped  
with other stuff) so I'm +0 on it.

One thing (maybe it was discussed): it would be nice if the solution  
was able to change the UI directly on the wiki it's defined so that  
the person who fills translations can see them in action by navigation  
to the wiki pages. That would help a lot especially by choosing text  
that fits in the target location.

My only worry is that I've seen that the tool requires to be the  
master which means (I think) that we cannot edit SVN files any more.  
We would need to find a way to make this error-proof somehow (special  
svn rights on some files/dirs, synchronization, Git branches, etc).  
This is probably not too urgent and we should probably see how it  
works in action first.

Thanks
-Vincent

On Nov 10, 2008, at 1:04 AM, Ludovic Dubost wrote:

>
> Any -1 votes ? Or should we proceed on setting up our own  
> l10n.xwiki.org
> tool ?
>
> Ludovic
>
> Ludovic Dubost wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I think we need to move forward and get to a decision on our  
>> approach.
>>
>> I've currently not been very convinced on the launchpad approach  
>> given
>> that it seems overly complex to get our translations loaded in their
>> system. The french translations I've been trying to load are  
>> blocked for
>> review (see https://translations.launchpad.net/xwiki/+imports ).  
>> Also I
>> don't see clearly where to get the source code for launchpad to  
>> have our
>> own install if we wanted, and how complex it would be given that
>> launchpad has many other features unrelated to translations.
>>
>> On the other hand, I've improved the speed of the translation app on
>> http://l10n.myxwiki.org using counting caches and it seems to work  
>> quite
>> well.
>>
>> So I would like to launch a vote to go with the XWiki translation
>> application approach and move it to it's own wiki on  
>> l10n.xwiki.org. We
>> also need this wiki to be UTF-8 in order to support translations in  
>> all
>> languages.
>>
>> Here is my +1 for using l10n.myxwiki.org
>>
>> Ludovic
>>
>> Ludovic Dubost wrote:
>>
>>> Hi team,
>>>
>>> I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we  
>>> could
>>> have for XWiki comparing:
>>>
>>> - a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
>>> - an L10N app I started to build
>>> - using launchpad.net
>>>
>>> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization
>>>
>>>
>>> Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have
>>> not been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and
>>> evaluate them in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net
>>> could work for us.
>>>
>>> Let's discuss.
>>>
>>> Ludovic
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Re: Selecting a tool to manage localization

99translations
This post has NOT been accepted by the mailing list yet.
In reply to this post by Ludovic Dubost
I would recommend you guys to check out 99translations.com. I find one negative feedback in this thread
, however I don't see any specific issues mentioned. I am pretty sure our web site can serve xwiki translation process very well.

You can see community driven translation process for UserVoice project going really fast where they have their web site translated to 22 languages in literally 3 weeks.

http://99translations.com/public_projects/show/23

If you have any questions or suggestions , please shoot and email to support@99translations.com
-- Simon

Ludovic Dubost wrote
Hi team,

I wrore a report about the different localization strategies we could
have for XWiki comparing:

- a simple tool Jean-Vincent wrote
- an L10N app I started to build
- using launchpad.net

http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Drafts/Selecting+a+tool+for+managing+Localization

Please review and add requirements if you see requirements that have not been listed. I think we need to look at the applications and evaluate them in more details, especially to see of launchpad.net could work for us.

Let's discuss.

Ludovic

--
Ludovic Dubost
Blog: http://blog.ludovic.org/
XWiki: http://www.xwiki.com
Skype: ldubost GTalk: ldubost


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tel;work:01 45 42 40 90
tel;fax:09 59 26 92 14
tel;home:09 54 26 92 14
tel;cell:06 09 34 92 14
x-mozilla-html:TRUE
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