[VOTE] Drop support for IE11

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[VOTE] Drop support for IE11

Ecaterina Moraru (Valica)
IE is the last browser we are supporting at a particular version, see
http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Community/BrowserSupportStrategy . For
all the other browsers, we are supporting just the latest release.

We are supporting the latest version of Microsoft Edge since XWiki 9.9,
starting from 24/Oct/17. Microsoft Edge replaced Internet Explorer as the
default web browser since the release of Windows 10 (launched Jul 2015).
Internet Explorer 11 is maintained on Windows 10 for compatibility
purposes, but is deprecated in favor of Edge and is no longer actively
developed.

We discussed dropping IE11 in the past Oct 6, 2017 (see
https://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/qsrkka6zfrmyxv3d), but the vote failed.

Some updated statistics:

--------------------------------------------------

XWiki.org's 1 year traffic (between Sep 30, 2016 - Sep 30, 2017) compared
to Oct 1, 2017 - May 31, 2018:
- Internet Explorer dropped from (5.84%) to (4.65%)
-- from this percentage, IE 11 usage has increased from (88.43%) to (88.76%)
- Edge increased from (1.56%) to (1.84%).

In terms of Worldwide market share for Desktops, for the past 12 months
(according to
http://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share/desktop/ ), we have Sep,
2016 - Sep, 2017 compared to May 2017 - May 2018:
- Internet Explorer dropped from 8.21% to 6.97%
- Edge dropped from 4.3% to 4.15%

In May 2018, Global Market Share Worldwide for All Platforms contains:
- Chrome 58.09%
- Safari 13.78%
- UC Browser 8.16%
- Firefox 5.27%
- Opera 3.68%
- Internet Explorer combined is at 3.08% (with IE 11 having 2.65%. IE11 in
August 2017 had 3.04%)
- Edge combined having 1.91% (Edge combined in August 2017 had 1.8%)
- etc.

--------------------------------------------------

In terms of statistics, IE11 is more used than Microsoft Edge. The only
argument of dropping IE11 is that it's a browser that is deprecated for
about 3 years, and it's limiting the usage of newer specifications (like
CSS Flex, Grid, etc.)

I'm curios about how this period of supporting both IE11 and Edge went, and
if you have other examples of things you wanted to use and are not
supported by IE11.

Thanks,
Caty
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Re: [VOTE] Drop support for IE11

Ecaterina Moraru (Valica)
So, this dropping of IE11 needs to be discussed, so please disregard the
[VOTE] part of the mail subject and provide feedback about this idea and
the needs you have technically.

Thanks,
Caty

On Tue, Jun 12, 2018 at 7:28 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> IE is the last browser we are supporting at a particular version, see
> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Community/BrowserSupportStrategy .
> For all the other browsers, we are supporting just the latest release.
>
> We are supporting the latest version of Microsoft Edge since XWiki 9.9,
> starting from 24/Oct/17. Microsoft Edge replaced Internet Explorer as the
> default web browser since the release of Windows 10 (launched Jul 2015).
> Internet Explorer 11 is maintained on Windows 10 for compatibility
> purposes, but is deprecated in favor of Edge and is no longer actively
> developed.
>
> We discussed dropping IE11 in the past Oct 6, 2017 (see
> https://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/qsrkka6zfrmyxv3d), but the vote failed.
>
> Some updated statistics:
>
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> XWiki.org's 1 year traffic (between Sep 30, 2016 - Sep 30, 2017) compared
> to Oct 1, 2017 - May 31, 2018:
> - Internet Explorer dropped from (5.84%) to (4.65%)
> -- from this percentage, IE 11 usage has increased from (88.43%) to
> (88.76%)
> - Edge increased from (1.56%) to (1.84%).
>
> In terms of Worldwide market share for Desktops, for the past 12 months
> (according to
> http://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share/desktop/ ), we have Sep,
> 2016 - Sep, 2017 compared to May 2017 - May 2018:
> - Internet Explorer dropped from 8.21% to 6.97%
> - Edge dropped from 4.3% to 4.15%
>
> In May 2018, Global Market Share Worldwide for All Platforms contains:
> - Chrome 58.09%
> - Safari 13.78%
> - UC Browser 8.16%
> - Firefox 5.27%
> - Opera 3.68%
> - Internet Explorer combined is at 3.08% (with IE 11 having 2.65%. IE11 in
> August 2017 had 3.04%)
> - Edge combined having 1.91% (Edge combined in August 2017 had 1.8%)
> - etc.
>
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> In terms of statistics, IE11 is more used than Microsoft Edge. The only
> argument of dropping IE11 is that it's a browser that is deprecated for
> about 3 years, and it's limiting the usage of newer specifications (like
> CSS Flex, Grid, etc.)
>
> I'm curios about how this period of supporting both IE11 and Edge went,
> and if you have other examples of things you wanted to use and are not
> supported by IE11.
>
> Thanks,
> Caty
>
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Re: [VOTE] Drop support for IE11

vmassol
Administrator
My POV:

* We need feedback from users, so I’d have asked on the forum first, asking users.
* I’d not drop support for IE11 right now in 10.x but in 11.0 at best (and it’ll depend on the answer on the first point)
* What is keeping support for IE11 costing us ATM, apart from the QA we do for it? Are there things we’re preventing from doing that we could do if we didn’t have IE11 to support? (sorry if it was in the older thread, didn’t read it yet)

Thanks
-Vincent

> On 12 Jun 2018, at 18:41, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> So, this dropping of IE11 needs to be discussed, so please disregard the
> [VOTE] part of the mail subject and provide feedback about this idea and
> the needs you have technically.
>
> Thanks,
> Caty
>
> On Tue, Jun 12, 2018 at 7:28 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> IE is the last browser we are supporting at a particular version, see
>> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Community/BrowserSupportStrategy .
>> For all the other browsers, we are supporting just the latest release.
>>
>> We are supporting the latest version of Microsoft Edge since XWiki 9.9,
>> starting from 24/Oct/17. Microsoft Edge replaced Internet Explorer as the
>> default web browser since the release of Windows 10 (launched Jul 2015).
>> Internet Explorer 11 is maintained on Windows 10 for compatibility
>> purposes, but is deprecated in favor of Edge and is no longer actively
>> developed.
>>
>> We discussed dropping IE11 in the past Oct 6, 2017 (see
>> https://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/qsrkka6zfrmyxv3d), but the vote failed.
>>
>> Some updated statistics:
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>>
>> XWiki.org's 1 year traffic (between Sep 30, 2016 - Sep 30, 2017) compared
>> to Oct 1, 2017 - May 31, 2018:
>> - Internet Explorer dropped from (5.84%) to (4.65%)
>> -- from this percentage, IE 11 usage has increased from (88.43%) to
>> (88.76%)
>> - Edge increased from (1.56%) to (1.84%).
>>
>> In terms of Worldwide market share for Desktops, for the past 12 months
>> (according to
>> http://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share/desktop/ ), we have Sep,
>> 2016 - Sep, 2017 compared to May 2017 - May 2018:
>> - Internet Explorer dropped from 8.21% to 6.97%
>> - Edge dropped from 4.3% to 4.15%
>>
>> In May 2018, Global Market Share Worldwide for All Platforms contains:
>> - Chrome 58.09%
>> - Safari 13.78%
>> - UC Browser 8.16%
>> - Firefox 5.27%
>> - Opera 3.68%
>> - Internet Explorer combined is at 3.08% (with IE 11 having 2.65%. IE11 in
>> August 2017 had 3.04%)
>> - Edge combined having 1.91% (Edge combined in August 2017 had 1.8%)
>> - etc.
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>>
>> In terms of statistics, IE11 is more used than Microsoft Edge. The only
>> argument of dropping IE11 is that it's a browser that is deprecated for
>> about 3 years, and it's limiting the usage of newer specifications (like
>> CSS Flex, Grid, etc.)
>>
>> I'm curios about how this period of supporting both IE11 and Edge went,
>> and if you have other examples of things you wanted to use and are not
>> supported by IE11.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Caty
>>

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Re: [VOTE] Drop support for IE11

Adel Atallah
Another solution would be to use non-IE11 features like CSS Flex or
grids and replace (in some way) css rules for IE11 browsers.
That way, we could have new features for newer browsers and a fallback
for IE11 browsers.
The main problem is that we would have more complexity, there would be
more code to write and also some cases might be difficult to handle.
So I wouldn't particularly go for this solution but I think it's worth
mentioning.

Thanks,
Adel


On Tue, Jun 12, 2018 at 6:47 PM, Vincent Massol <[hidden email]> wrote:

> My POV:
>
> * We need feedback from users, so I’d have asked on the forum first, asking users.
> * I’d not drop support for IE11 right now in 10.x but in 11.0 at best (and it’ll depend on the answer on the first point)
> * What is keeping support for IE11 costing us ATM, apart from the QA we do for it? Are there things we’re preventing from doing that we could do if we didn’t have IE11 to support? (sorry if it was in the older thread, didn’t read it yet)
>
> Thanks
> -Vincent
>
>> On 12 Jun 2018, at 18:41, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> So, this dropping of IE11 needs to be discussed, so please disregard the
>> [VOTE] part of the mail subject and provide feedback about this idea and
>> the needs you have technically.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Caty
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 12, 2018 at 7:28 PM, Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) <
>> [hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> IE is the last browser we are supporting at a particular version, see
>>> http://dev.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Community/BrowserSupportStrategy .
>>> For all the other browsers, we are supporting just the latest release.
>>>
>>> We are supporting the latest version of Microsoft Edge since XWiki 9.9,
>>> starting from 24/Oct/17. Microsoft Edge replaced Internet Explorer as the
>>> default web browser since the release of Windows 10 (launched Jul 2015).
>>> Internet Explorer 11 is maintained on Windows 10 for compatibility
>>> purposes, but is deprecated in favor of Edge and is no longer actively
>>> developed.
>>>
>>> We discussed dropping IE11 in the past Oct 6, 2017 (see
>>> https://xwiki.markmail.org/thread/qsrkka6zfrmyxv3d), but the vote failed.
>>>
>>> Some updated statistics:
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> XWiki.org's 1 year traffic (between Sep 30, 2016 - Sep 30, 2017) compared
>>> to Oct 1, 2017 - May 31, 2018:
>>> - Internet Explorer dropped from (5.84%) to (4.65%)
>>> -- from this percentage, IE 11 usage has increased from (88.43%) to
>>> (88.76%)
>>> - Edge increased from (1.56%) to (1.84%).
>>>
>>> In terms of Worldwide market share for Desktops, for the past 12 months
>>> (according to
>>> http://gs.statcounter.com/browser-market-share/desktop/ ), we have Sep,
>>> 2016 - Sep, 2017 compared to May 2017 - May 2018:
>>> - Internet Explorer dropped from 8.21% to 6.97%
>>> - Edge dropped from 4.3% to 4.15%
>>>
>>> In May 2018, Global Market Share Worldwide for All Platforms contains:
>>> - Chrome 58.09%
>>> - Safari 13.78%
>>> - UC Browser 8.16%
>>> - Firefox 5.27%
>>> - Opera 3.68%
>>> - Internet Explorer combined is at 3.08% (with IE 11 having 2.65%. IE11 in
>>> August 2017 had 3.04%)
>>> - Edge combined having 1.91% (Edge combined in August 2017 had 1.8%)
>>> - etc.
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> In terms of statistics, IE11 is more used than Microsoft Edge. The only
>>> argument of dropping IE11 is that it's a browser that is deprecated for
>>> about 3 years, and it's limiting the usage of newer specifications (like
>>> CSS Flex, Grid, etc.)
>>>
>>> I'm curios about how this period of supporting both IE11 and Edge went,
>>> and if you have other examples of things you wanted to use and are not
>>> supported by IE11.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Caty
>>>
>